Wednesday, December 14, 2005

Feminism, labels, and principles

An interesting discussion at Protein Wisdom about feminism and labels. Equity feminism, gender feminism, establishment feminism, liberal feminism, ifeminism... my head is spinning.

I don't have time for a long post right now, but a few thoughts. Christina Hoff Sommers' "equity feminism/gender feminism" distinction (originally made in the 1994 book Who Stole Feminism?), which I've sometimes used myself, is rather imprecise, and too open to being used as shorthand for "feminists I like/feminists I don't like." Sommers defines "gender feminists" as those who see women as oppressed by a "sex/gender system" ingrained in cultural gender roles, and "equity feminists" as those who want simply to establish legal equality and equality of opportunity. But one needn't be a particularly radical feminist to believe that various aspects of traditional gender roles lead to unequal opportunity, and one can seek to transform those roles while seeking "equity" rather than female advantage. (Many of the early feminists Sommers praises, such as Mary Wollstonecraft and Elizabeth Cady Stanton, were harshly critical not only of legal and institutional inequality but of traditional femininity.)

So, what terms would I use? Actually, "equity feminism" and "gender feminism" still make sense to me, but I would fine-tune the definitions somewhat. "Equity feminism" is focused on fairness and equal treatment for individuals regardless of gender; "gender feminism" -- a form of identity politics -- is focused on solidarity with women and seeking the betterment of women. However, as Jeff has found out, the term "gender feminism" is fairly useless in discussions with feminists to whom one would apply the term, since they regard it as a slur (much as I do "anti-feminist"). I wonder if "identity feminism" would be an acceptable term?

In any case: Here are a few basic principles of my kind of feminism, whatever one wants to call it.

1. Equal treatment regardless of gender. No excuses for unequal treatment such as "we need to make allowances for women's lack of power/history of oppression," "real equality means redistributing power from the oppressor to the oppressed," etc. Feminism should be about equity, fairness and judging people as individuals, not "siding with women" (individually or collectively).

2. We should seek to achieve greater equity/equality by expanding choices for both men and women, not narrowing them -- e.g., not make it less socially acceptable for women to stay home with their children, but to make this option more available to men. Equity does not necessarily mean full parity in every field; it means equal opportunity, including freedom from cultural barriers that can hold men or women back from excercising their options (e.g., the belief that it's unmanly to be a child care worker, or that a woman should be interested in "people things" rather than scientific abstractions).

3. Western women today are not an oppressed or powerless group. While women have some gender-based problems, so do men. Gender-based disadvantages and prejudices should be addressed whether they affect men or women. In today's society, "more for women" is not necessarily synonymous with justice.

4. Women as well as men can be sexist -- toward men as well as women -- and can have sexist expectations of and prejudices toward men. Female chauvinism (e.g., the belief that mothers have a special bond with their children inherently superior to that of fathers) should be taken as seriously as male chauvinism.

5. Not everything bad that happens to women (e.g., rape or domestic violence) is the result of sexism or "the patriarchy" (which, in my view, is a meaningless concept when talking about the West in the 21st Century). Women's personal wrongs in relationships with men should not be considered a feminist issue unless some institutional or cultural bias against women is involved (for instance, a man's belief that he is entitled to multiple sex partners but his wife or girlfriend is not).

6. Claims of sexism, sex discrimination, or male mistreatment of women should be taken seriously, but not given a presumption of truthfulness and objectivity. Giving a woman's account greater credence than a man's because of her gender is just as sexist as presuming a man to be more believable.

7. Finally, my kind of feminism takes a non-adversarial stance toward Western and American society. This was brought home to me by Jeff Goldstein's exchange with Lauren, who sees a young Muslim immigrant's decision to wear the hijab as possibly a positive and empowering one because it's a protest against the majority culture. I don't regard an adversarial stance vis-a-vis American culture as something valuable in itself. For all its flaws and its much-less-than-perfect history where women are concerned, the West today is the civilization that champions freedom and equal rights for women. For that alone, from a feminist point of view, it is worth defending.

103 comments:

Paul said...

I have been a feminist for years and do not mind that some females are as well !

EricP said...

Just a quick note, it was Lauren, not Jill who made the hijab post.

Anonymous said...

Well-defined terms are essential to reasoned discourse and exceedingly rare in our label-mad culture.
Next up - "liberal" and "conservative"?

Lauren said...

Cathy, I agree with much of what you've written here, but I still find the binary problematic because it is so very reductive.

Additionally, my post in question has been misread multiple times, so I feel the need to reiterate that my primary point was to vent my thoughts on the multilayered cultural politics at play in my student's non-conformist assignment, and secondly to reconsider cultural cues such as hijab in a non-oppressive Western environment. I'm still baffled as to why my public wonderment is so controversial.

Lauren said...

"For all its flaws and its much-less-than-perfect history where women are concerned, the West today is the civilization that champions freedom and equal rights for women. For that alone, from a feminist point of view, it is worth defending."

Agreed, and yet not. I realize you were pressed for time when you wrote this, but here goes:

The idealist in me believes this to be true, though the real fight is for the hearts and minds of individuals to nix emphasis on arbitrary gender divisions that lead to more systematic divisions.

The realist in me is nevertheless required to point out that Western feminism is not the only defender of women worldwide (though by virtue of the West we have considerable clout that must be considered) and women are using their varying abilities to improve their own conditions in their own environments on their own terms. Women who wear hijab are not delicate flowers under headscarves simply by virtue of being women in a patriarchal religion in a patriarchal society, &c. They do have agency and they are using it.

Anonymous said...

The only problem with this whole line of argument is that it's wrong, and comes from a misunderstanding of how language works (and that is what the disagreement comes down to - language.) Words do not come from the dictionary. You cannot arbitrarily define what words mean. Case in point: Sommers invented the terms "equity feminism" and "gender feminism" eleven years ago but I find no evidence of these terms ever actually being used except in cases when they are being defined (or re-defined).

Like it or not, "feminism" means "gender feminism" (or "identity feminism") and always has. There never was a golden age when the term just referred to basic egalitarianism and individualism applied to gender (which is what "equity feminism" is supposed to mean.) True, there may have been a time where the main emphasis in feminism was on fighting inegalitarian policies and anti-individualism, but that was because those were the main (and most obvious) anti-feminist battles. (Incidentally, I think this still holds true. If a policy which blatantly discriminated on the base of gender against women were enacted, all feminists would oppose it, and you can bet the first arguments out of their mouths would be individualist arguments and appeals to equality under the law).

Let's consider a thought experiment. You take a sample of, say, 1000 people who are self-proclaimed feminists. You show them writings from some mainstream NOW member, from some university Woman's Studies professor, from some radical Marxist feminist, from some MacKinnon/Dworkin radical feminist, from some Starhawk-Gaia goddess separatist type, etc. You also show them writings from Cathy Young, Wendy McElroy, maybe Camille Paglia. You ask them one question only: Is the person who wrote this a feminist? You are not asking them whether they agree with the person, or how close the person's beliefs are to their own, only whether the person is a feminist or not.

I think the answer would be clear. All of the people in the first group would be considered feminists by the great majority of the respondents. There wouldn't be much variation. Andrea Dworkin would be considered just as much a feminist as Ellen Goodman or Gloria Steinem. People in the second group would, however, not be considered feminists by the majority. Your average NOW member, even though she may have more in common with Cathy Young than with Andrea Dworkin on most things, would still recognize Dworkin as a feminist, because they share in common the essential belief of feminism: that women are oppressed.

So, Cathy Young, the answer is that you are anti-feminist. I mean this as a simple objective description. That is not to say that you are anti-female. They are two different things. What you are in favor of is applying egalitarianism and individualism to gender, not feminism. And that's a good thing.

Cathy Young said...

Lauren, a pleasure to see you here, and I just corrected my post which mis-attributed your hijab post to Jill.

I hope to be able to reply soon.

Cathy Young said...

anonymous (12pm post) -- well, that's an interesting viewpoint, but the problem is that just as the label "feminist" does not distinguish between Andrea Dworkin and Ellen Goodman, the label "anti-feminist" does not distinguish between Wendy McElroy and, say, F. Carolyn Graglia, whose anti-feminism is explicitly anti-egalitarian (or even outspoken misogynists such as the "Fathers' Manifesto" group).

William R. Barker said...

While some of the jargon leaves my head spinning (*SMILE*) I agree with Cathy's initial post.

Yet...

I also agree with the Anonymous post of Wed Dec 14, 12:00:00 PM EST.

Hmm...

I'm not quite sure if I've contradicted myself here, but... however you want to label those who believe in the general ideals of equality... put me in that camp!

Pooh said...

Anon, the irony of your post is that while claiming that "this is how language works" you end by saying something that doesn't mean what you claim you intend.

Anti-Feminist, to most, means anti-female. (Query, didn't we talk about this, at length within the last two weeks?) You can claim you don't mean it that way, but next thing you know, Cathy's arguments get dismissed (*cough*Barry*cough*) as 'anti-feminist' and therefore anti-female and therefore not worthy of consideration.

I also find it curious that the central tenet of feminism, as you define it, is that women are oppressed. That strikes me as an inherently self-defeating ideology.

Eighty-Eight said...

Hi Cathy,

This is the poster formerly known as Anonymous88, and briefly Dancer88. In the future, I’ll just go by Eighty-Eight.

Thank you for this post, which was very useful in helping to understand your positions. I have a question for further clarification. In your view, are there any circumstances in which a history of oppression is a relevant factor in the consideration of a group, if the oppression has been rectified in the law, but perhaps not yet in practice? I understand that you believe women in the west are no longer oppressed, but I was curious as to your position on other groups in which the legacy of the oppression is generally still agreed upon as having current-day effects. An example might be a marginalized minority within a developing country (just to take the discussion away from sensitive domestic issues.)

Revenant said...

Well said, Cathy.

And Anon -- words mean what people use them to mean, nothing more. You might not have heard the terms Cathy is using before, but plenty of other people have. Indeed, the dictionary definition of "feminism" is that of equity feminism, not gender feminism.

Ampersand said...

Cathy wrote: well, that's an interesting viewpoint, but the problem is that just as the label "feminist" does not distinguish between Andrea Dworkin and Ellen Goodman, the label "anti-feminist" does not distinguish between Wendy McElroy and, say, F. Carolyn Graglia, whose anti-feminism is explicitly anti-egalitarian (or even outspoken misogynists such as the "Fathers' Manifesto" group).

I've already agreed that I won't refer to you as an anti-feminist in the future. But nonetheless, I don't follow your logic here.

It's agreed by all that the label "feminist" includes a wide variety of views, such as Andrea Dworkin's and Ellen Goodman's. The fact that Dworkin and Goodman (or, even more so, Dworkin and Susie Bright) are at complete loggerheads on many substantial issues doesn't prevent them from both being feminists.

So why is it a problem that the lablel "anti-feminist" should include a variety of views, some at complete loggerheads?

Regarding this:

This was brought home to me by Jeff Goldstein's exchange with Lauren, who sees a young Muslim immigrant's decision to wear the hijab as possibly a positive and empowering one because it's a protest against the majority culture. I don't regard an adversarial stance vis-a-vis American culture as something valuable in itself.

I don't think Lauren's post can be accurately described as taking "an adversarial stance vis-a-vis American culture" in itself. As I read the post, the student was responding to the racist culture of the school around her, and to the hypersexualization of American teen culture.

But surely a reaction against a particular racist school culture, or against a particular specific aspect of American culture, is not the same as taking a stance against American culture in and of itself.

Richard Bennett said...

The hijab thing illustrates what's wrong with the strand of feminism that's founded on the belief that women are oppressed by a patriarchal conspiracy. The need for identity that's expressed in this group is so strong that it has to actually fight against equality. Equality, after all, undermines the basis of this form of feminist identity and threatens the whole enterprise.

The woman who chooses to wear the hijab participates in her own oppression and reifies it. Thus, she strengthens the foundations of identity feminism and is therefore lauded by its membership.

Identity feminists oppress women, in other words.

Forbes said...

"Western feminism is not the only defender of women worldwide...and women are using their varying abilities to improve their own conditions in their own environments on their own terms."

Wow! Now there's a load of nonsense! What was western feminism doing for the women of Afghanistan? Or Iraq? Or, and I could go on and on...

What western feminists have mostly done is stand back, doing little, and/or find common cause with oppressive regimes--but mostly to oppose US efforts to bring freedom, liberty, the voting franchise, and a modicum of equality to those parts of the world.

(And since Cathy Young is called an anti-feminist, by these so-called feminists, Ms. Young, of course, is excluded from my preceeding generalization.)

Lauren, you can ramble on all you want about your binary reductive problem with arbitrary gender assignments that trigger non-conformist cultural responses in a multilayered, non-oppressive Western environment, but until you straighten out the rhetorical pretzel you've twisted up, unintelligible--rather than controversial--is the only characterization such thoughts earn. (What, pray tell, is a non-oppresive western environment? Other than a women's locker room?)

Oh, and best of luck to all the third world muslim women using their agency to improve their liberty. Yup, powerful tool, that agency. You should be proud of your hard work on their behalf, Lauren!

Cheers.

Lauren said...

Forbes, do a Google search on Muslim feminism and see what you come up with. You might be surprised.

just another lurker said...

Wow, great post Cathy. And I was surprised to hear you dare to use the term I personally prefer: "female chauvinism". Chauvinism in the strict dictionary definition, i.e., "unreasoning devotion to one's own race, sex, etc., with contempt for other races or the opposite sex".

When viewed from this angle I find that many instances of truly mindbending pretzel logic (from what you would call gender feminists) become immediately clear.

reader_iam said...

In my experience, the word "labels" is almost always at odds with the word "principles."

Those who most quickly rush to label, or more specifically, demand to be the arbiter of who is what, tend to get distracted and end up equating labels with principles. Which, of course, they really don't. Not in any kind of practical,
on-the-ground sense, in terms of actually improving the daily lives of real people living in the real world.

The semantic stuff may be fun, but in the end that's basically all it amounts to: a game.

That's how I see it, anyway.

(And I do, very much, think that words matter very much. Words actually happen; labels stall. And to the degree they stall, they also put the skids on more important things.)

Anonymous said...

http://trishwilson.typepad.com/blog/2005/12/feminism_vs_equ.html#comments

trish wilson has an interesting take on it

Anonymous said...

fix the the link http://tinyurl.com/c325n

mythago said...

While women have some gender-based problems, so do men. Gender-based disadvantages and prejudices should be addressed whether they affect men or women.

Cathy, what annoys me about your usually rather sensible discussions is the not-very-well-hidden assumption that sexism hurts men and women equally and that men and women get equal benefits from sexism. It's one thing to recognize that sexism harms men (you'd have to be an idiot not to), but you don't like to consider that sexism might have more benefits and less drawbacks for men.

Glaivester said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Glaivester said...

Let me explain what anonymous was saying more simply.

Feminism means that you support increasing women's rights relative to men's.

Feminism has nothing to do with equality per se. Where men are favored, feminism happens to coincide with equality. Where women are favored, feminism is anti-equality.

That is all.

Pooh said...

Mythago,

WHAT? There has been no attempt at equivalance here. Unless arguing that in certain instances women have more rights than men means you are saying that that makes them equally oppressed. It's called nuance.

jw said...

It is best to consider sexism and its harm in terms of insurance. We effectively demand all females have insurance against sexism and at the same time demand that no male has such insurance.

If no serious things go wrong in one's life, one is better off to be male. But, if something serious does go wrong, it is far far better to be female.

That group of males seriously harmed by institutional sexism is far more harmed than that group of females seriously harmed by sexism.

Therefore, we are not and cannot talk of sexism in terms of groups as it disproportionally harms most a subset of the male population.

Pablo said...

mythago says:

It's one thing to recognize that sexism harms men (you'd have to be an idiot not to), but you don't like to consider that sexism might have more benefits and less drawbacks for men.

I don't mind considering the possibility, but I don't believe it's true.

Between Family Courts and the Domestic Violence industry, our very society is systematically abusing men in very serious, damaging, life-changing ways. Oh, and the kids get some of the grief too!

Day in, day out. Day after day after day after day... In what forums are women so systematically abused?

beAzl said...

With all due respect (and actually the respect is great enough that I suspect you will prove me wrong) I am afraid you are in danger of getting stuck in an intellectual cul-de-sac.

In Thomas Sowell’s "Vision of the anointed", he argues (I am sure it is not original – does it come from Kant maybe?) that every principle follows a law of diminishing returns. Saying the truth is a fine principle, that should be followed instinctively most of the time, until that madman wielding a knife comes to your door looking for your friend you are hiding in you basement. Ultimately, every principle should be subservient to a higher cause – promoting some sum total of happiness/prosperity/lack of fear, that kind of thing, with a special emphasis on your own, since only you know what will truly make you happy – basically utilitarianism, though I am sure utilitarianism has its own holes to contend with.

As explained in the link Rooting Out Discrimination in Home Mortgage Lending there are three motivations for treating people unequally:

Bigotry – not caring, or even cheering, when you see Rodney King being beaten, because he is black.

Cultural Affinity – not knowing anyone in your country club who is Chinese, and you only hire people you trust, and you only trust people in your country club.

Statistical Discrimination – charging young men more for car insurance (sorry for that obsession of mine), because they are statistically more likely to get in a car accident.


As explained in the article, understanding what the motivation is is extremely important. How you combat it can be completely different. Whereas bigotry is weakened by competition, by education, by appeals to number one, statistical discrimination is strengthened by all these things.

Someone in this post provided a link to a post that argues that women should be given priority in custody battles because statistically they are more dedicated parents. This is statistical discrimination (if backed up by accurate statistics). I think you need to either accept that argument, or give utilitarian arguments why it is bad to follow that policy. First of all, are the statistics wrong? Is the author prepared, for example, to accept similar arguments when applied in favor of men vs women (possibly for example when hiring for a job that requires long hours and long-term dedication to the job, which might put women at a disadvantage precisely because they are more dedicated parents, statistically)? Can we not trust ourselves to make these kinds of judgments, because it will too easily lapse into bigotry? Is it okay to trust private actors to make these kinds of judgments, but not government agencies, due to their monopoly on force? Or can we trust no one? What circumstances make it okay, and why?

All I see coming from you (again with mucho respect) is "but that’s just wrong!" which I for one find unsatisfying.

What am I missing?

Mary said...

I've been watching this unfold for some time, and have written a response here.

mary said...

Eh, this is the link I meant to give

Pooh said...

Mary, nice summary of what's been going on, and interesting thoughts.

How much of the schism between the groups you identify is a dispute about the 'facts on the ground' as to the 'oppressedness' (is that a word? it should be,) of women in America?

Revenant said...

you don't like to consider that sexism might have more benefits and less drawbacks for men.

Except that sexism doesn't benefit men. If, for example, women are discriminated against as doctors, that provides a minor benefit to male doctors, but a significant penalty to everybody else (we receive lower-quality care at higher cost). The effect of widespread discrimination is similar to that of a high tariff on all goods -- it is, on net, harmful to everyone. It makes everything more expensive and lower-quality than it otherwise would be.

Plus, of course, there's the fact that almost all men marry women at some point. Discrimination against your wife hurts you, too -- it makes your family poorer and your home life unhappier. Plus, since half your kids will be women, and sexism hurts the victim more than it helps the beneficiary, on average sexism will be harmful to your progeny.

No, there's no upside to sexism. It is a remarkably bad idea, both from a moral and a pragmatic viewpoint.

Darleen said...

Cathy

You don't have trackbacks so I'm leaving this link in the comment section. I think your list is a good start, but IMHO it leaves a few things off. I'm in the process of developing a graph that I hope will clearly demonstrate the differences in contemporary feminism. Any input as I develope questions welcome!

drumgurl said...

Beazl: In short, statistical discrimination is harmful because of its attack on individualism.

Statistical discrimination harms those who do not fit stereotypes. For example, the dad who is the more dedicated parent gets discriminated against because, statistically (supposedly!), women tend to be more dedicated parents. But what do the actions of OTHER men have to do with him? Nothing!

But it doesn't just hurt the dad. It hurts the children, too. And that can have all kinds of negative effects on society as a whole.

Likewise, women who are unfairly "mommy-tracked" in the workforce are harmed when it is assumed they'll be less dedicated to their work. But it also harms the company because they are missing out on what she has to offer. And that can indirectly factor into higher prices for the company's customers.

For a more articulate example of what I'm trying to say, see revenant's first paragraph.

By the way, great post, Cathy! I hope I didn't appear to be speaking for you on the Protein Wisdom blog.

Cathy Young said...

ampersand:

It's agreed by all that the label "feminist" includes a wide variety of views, such as Andrea Dworkin's and Ellen Goodman's. The fact that Dworkin and Goodman (or, even more so, Dworkin and Susie Bright) are at complete loggerheads on many substantial issues doesn't prevent them from both being feminists.

So why is it a problem that the lablel "anti-feminist" should include a variety of views, some at complete loggerheads?


Interesting question.

I think Susie Bright and Andrea Dworkin certainly shared the basic belief that women should have freedom and equality with men, even though they defined these concepts quite differently. Certainly, both saw themselves as pursuing female empowerment (again, while understanding it very differently).

I don't see myself as having any common ground with, say, F. Carolyn Graglia, other than the fact that she and I are both critical of "established" feminism. However, I think that people should generally be defined by what they believe in, rather than what they're against. Otherwise it's a bit like lumping together atheists and religious Jews because both groups are non-Christian.

mythago: Just to clarify, my comment about gender disadvantage being a two-day street applied solely to Western civilization in the last 20-25 years. That's how things look to me, at least. What are some of the areas where you believe women in America or Europe today are more disadvantaged by gender-based biases or barriers than men?

Lauren and Barry, on the hijab issue: having read Lauren's post, I definitely did not get the impression that Muizza's primary reason for wearing the hijab was to protest the racism in the school (and the added bit about her garb being a protest against the hypersexualization of teenage girls in America is simply speculation). Isn't there a way to protest racism without endorsing a symbol of female submission? (I think it's quite telling that in many Muslim immigrant communities, men are not expected to wear traditional religious garb or to have beards, but women are expected to dress traditionally.) I also think it's a bit naive to refer to Muizza's environment as "non-oppressive"; in many immigrant communities, the pressure on young girls to follow traditional rules of modest dress is very strong.

No time to answer all the other posts right now, but Mary, very interesting post! Darleen, I'll check out your link; good to see you back here. And drumgurl, welcome to the Y Files!

beAzl said...

According to Family Structure...:

The few studies to compare
child well-being in single-mother versus single-father families yield mixed results. Single-father families have more economic resources than single mother
families, yet children from these two family forms perform similarly
in school (Downey 1994). Economic factors are better predictors of school performance among children in single-father families, whereas interpersonal resources (e.g., parental involvement and supervision) play a larger role
among children from single-mother families. There are few effects of gender
of the single parent on children’s self-esteem, verbal and math abilities, and
relationships with peers (Downey, Ainsworth-Darnell, and Dufur 1998).
Furthermore, there is little evidence that children do better when they reside
with a same-gender single parent (Powell and Downey 1997).
To our knowledge, just one study of delinquency, specifically drug and
alcohol use, has included a single-father family category (Hoffman and Johnson
1998). Relative to adolescents in single-mother families, those in singlefather
families are significantly more likely to have used marijuana, used
other illicit drugs, been drunk three or more times, and have problem alcohol
or drug use in the past year. Adolescents residing in single-father or fatherstepmother
families appear to be most likely to exhibit these delinquent outcomes
(net of controls for gender, age, race, family income, and residential
mobility), although the authors did not explicitly test this contrast. Our study
extends prior research on the significance of broken homes and adolescent delinquency by distinguishing between single-mother and single-father families
to determine whether the family structure effect documented by prior
research is predominantly a function of parental absence or the gender of the resident parent.


Looks to me like the evidence is too weak to justify discrimination anyway, so the issue is probably moot.

mythago said...

Cathy, you're arguing that a smaller gap means no gap.

You seem to be arguing that 20-25 years ago, it was true that men had more advantages and fewer disadvantages, but that's no longer the case. What do you believe the greater advantage was, and how has it changed in the last two decades?

Revenant said...

how has it changed in the last two decades?

Well, one fairly obvious change is that the workforce shifted. In 1980 most of the workforce had grown up and worked much of their careers in workplaces where sexual and/or racial discrimination was normal. Over the past 25 years most of those people retired or died. Today only the oldest workers have any memory of such a time. There is no longer an expectation that women will have a second-class role in the workplace.

Cathy Young said...

eighty-eight:

In your view, are there any circumstances in which a history of oppression is a relevant factor in the consideration of a group, if the oppression has been rectified in the law, but perhaps not yet in practice? I understand that you believe women in the west are no longer oppressed, but I was curious as to your position on other groups in which the legacy of the oppression is generally still agreed upon as having current-day effects. An example might be a marginalized minority within a developing country (just to take the discussion away from sensitive domestic issues.)


Sorry I missed this before. A very interesting question, and one that I think may warrant a blogpost of its own.

Obviously, I think culture matters, not only legal equality. I hope to elaborate on this later, but for now: I think the integration of women into public life and non-traditional roles, in a way, has been much easier than the integration of minority groups, because women don't (IMO) have a separate culture. Quite a few white men in positions of power have actively promoted women in the workplace because they have career-oriented daughters they care about. That's not a factor with regard to minorities.

Mythago: do you mean the gap in earnings and high-level jobs? Because I don't think that's the only measure of societal advantage.

In terms of "lifestyle choices," I think women today clearly have more options than men do (i.e., to work part-time or stay home after having children). The flip side of those options is that women can get blamed much more easily for not being "good enough parents," and the option to stay home or cut down on work can become an expectation. But this is where I think it's debatable "who has it worse, men or women," and a lot depends on the individual situation.

mythago said...

In terms of "lifestyle choices," I think women today clearly have more options than men do (i.e., to work part-time or stay home after having children).

This always strikes me as a bit like the argument that women have more freedom than men do because we can wear skirts OR pants. It ignores the fact that one of our 'options' is rather more heavily promoted than the other, and that we do not in fact have the same options as men. For example, "I am going to leave all the childcare to my spouse, and focus on my career" is not viewed the same when a woman does this as a man.

And, of course, one of those options involves economic vulnerability and dependency.

Of course it's true that all men do not have an advantage over all women, or that sexism only harms men or benefits women. I'm referring to the overall picture, though, and I don't see the point in pretending that everybody is benefited and harmed equally. I guess it's a useful fiction if you're trying to persuade men to work against sexism, and fear that they will be defensive and unhelpful if it's suggested they are not equally "oppressed".

colagirl said...

This always strikes me as a bit like the argument that women have more freedom than men do because we can wear skirts OR pants. It ignores the fact that one of our 'options' is rather more heavily promoted than the other

All I can say is, where I work, the dress code for uniformed personell at least is pants, for both male and female. Among the non-uniformed personell where I worked, and at my last job, the women I saw wearing skirts seemed to be doing so as an expression of their individuality (i.e. one woman was kind of a "Tolkien freak" and really into flowing, fairy-tale type clothing--she also wore a lot of handmade pewter jewelry; another woman enjoyed sewing and would wear outfits that she made at home, including skirts--for added fun, try imagining a man coming into work, being asked where he got that nice pair of slacks, and saying, "Oh, I made these on my sewing machine.") Most women routinely wore pants, including myself and my own immediate boss. So I don't know if that analogy works for me....

mythago said...

for added fun, try imagining a man coming into work, being asked where he got that nice pair of slacks, and saying, "Oh, I made these on my sewing machine

Imagine a woman coming in and saying "Hell, I don't know where these pants came from. My husband bought them for me."

Cathy Young said...

Imagine a woman coming in and saying "Hell, I don't know where these pants came from. My husband bought them for me."

The response would probably be "how nice, he bought you a present."

If it was clear that the husband was buying the woman's clothes on a regular basis, I wouldn't be surprised if some people suspected that she was in an abusive relationship. In fact, some years ago I attended a workshop on abuse in which one of the presenters mentioned, as one likely symptom of an abusive relationship, the man shopping for his wife's clothes.

By the way, I'm a bit confused; are you saying that women are still culturally discouraged from wearing pants?

Lori Heine said...

Although I have long considered myself a feminist, I don't particularly like the word "feminism" in any context. It implies that I must be "for"
women and "against" men -- as if the rights of one sex are somehow automatically at odds with those of the other. The very word itself, in my opinion, is threatening to many men because of this implication.

Let's be honest. When a man calls himself a "masculinist" (if he dares do such a thing), what do most people think? They assume he must be a woman-hating jerk. Why choose a name for ourselves that unnecessarily provokes hostility?

I favor equal rights for every human being -- male or female, Black or White, gay or straight. Why don't we find a new name for women who seek to promote womens' rights -- one that fosters solidarity with men instead of dissent?

Just don't ask me what that wondrous new name might be, because I've been pondering the question for years and still don't have a clue.

mythago said...

The response would probably be "how nice, he bought you a present."

Speaking from experience, it's more along the lines of a confused "Oh..." And I live in California.

Really, what I was getting at is not about pants, homemade or otherwise, but the notion that because women have some entry into the better-paid, prestigious 'man's world', that they are not only equal to men, but have more options--with the implication that women are, really, better off than men. It's true that legally both men and women have equal options, but the culture--and the de facto working world--have a lot of catch-up to do.

If we're going back to the clothes example, I'd note that men in my profession can simply pick a plain gray suit and be done with it. Women have more "choices" as far as clothes go (wow, we can wear colors!), but we also have to worry about hem length, pantyhouse, shoes, blouses, and so on in a way that men don't, and aren't judged by.

Anonymous said...

Mythago, this sounds dangerously close to "oppression through options." I hope that is not what you meant.

Anonymous said...

I was enheartened by your balanced comments on this issue.

When I was in my mid-30's, I had reached the ceiling at my job and wanted to expand my horizons; so, I went to law school at night. I was excited about moving from engineering to law; I felt like the sky was the limit.

New lawyers really need to spend some time with established attorneys as mentors before launching out on their own; and that's what I tried to do. I was slam-dunked and run off from almost every job I ever got -- by the female support staff.

I had been warned in law school about this; but I hadn't worried about it because I have always been a fair-minded, cooperative individual, careful not to tread on toes or invade others' space, and showing deference to everyone. Nevertheless, as the person responsible for the outcome of the cases, I was forced to make decisions, some large but mostly small, about how things were to be done. As I saw it, the job of the support staff was to help me help the client.

Boy, was I wrong.

I no longer practice law. I have been effectively been driven out of the profession because women who I thought were supposed to help me pushed me out.

I have struggled to understand what happened. My wife has suggested that the women resent me because they think I act like I'm supposed to be in charge because I'm the man, when in reality I act like I'm supposed to be in charge because I'm the one responsible for the work being done. It has nothing to do with gender; it's about who's accountable to the client and the profession.

I've tried being self-deprecating, even, giving way to everything until an issue comes up that I must deal with authoritatively; and even that doesn't work. I actually had a paralegal read me the riot act one day because I didn't defer to her redaction of the grammar I used in one of my letters (and she was wrong). To her, this was evidence that I was too big for my britches.

I gave up. I now work at a job far below my qualifications. I was making more in engineering almost 20 years ago than I am making now, and that's in unadjusted dollars. I have read some about the feminization of the American office, and it seems other people have had experiences similar to mine. It seems as if these days, in order to succeed in the office environment, you have to apologize not only for being in charge, but also for being male.

I also read that our young boys are being punished in elementary school for acting like boys.

I will be glad when the pendulum swings back toward the center again.

Thank you for letting me post.

huyuni said...

China Wholesale has been described as the world’s factory. This phenomenom is typified by the rise of buy products wholesalebusiness. Incredible range of products available with wholesale from china“Low Price and High Quality” not only reaches directly to their target clients worldwide but also ensures that China Wholesalers from China means margins you cannot find elsewhere and China Wholesale will skyroket your profits.

huyuni said...

Thank you so much!!cheap polo shirts men'ssweate,Burberry Polo Shirts lacoste sweater, ralph lauren Columbia Jackets,ski clothing. Free Shipping, PayPal Payment. Enjoy your shopping experience on mensclothingus.com.You can find the father who desire fashionable, intellectual mens clothing simultaneouslyGod bless you!I really agree with your opinions.Also,there are some new fashion things here,gillette razor blades.gillette mach3 razor bladesfor men.As for ladies,gillette venus razor blades must the best gift for you in summer,gillette fusion blades are all the best choice for you.Fantastic!God bless you!Meanwhile,you can visit my ,we have the highest quality but the lowest price fashion products wholesale from China.Here are the most popular China Wholesale products for all of you.You can visit .Also the is a great choice for you.

huyuni said...

nike shoes & Puma Shoes Online- tn nike,puma shoes,puma cat, baskets cheap nike shox, air max.cheap nike shox r4 torch, cheap nike air, nike running shoes air max, puma speed and more. Paypal payment.nike running shoes Enjoy your shopping experience on Nike & Puma Shoes Online Store.

huyuni said...

Lacoste Polo Shirts, , Burberry Polo Shirts.wholesale Lacoste polo shirts and cheap polo shirtswith great price. clothingol.com offers lot of 10ralph lauren polo lacoste polo shirts and lot of 20 Burberry Polo Shirts. clothingol.com offers classic fit polo shirts. polo clothingCheap Brand Jeans ShopMen Jeans - True Religion Jeans, burberry polo shirtsGUCCI Jeans, Levi's Jeans, D&G Jeans, RED MONKEY Jeans, Cheap JeansArmani Jeans, Diesel Jeans, Ed hardy Jeans, Evisu Jeans, Women JeansJack&Jones Jeans...

huyuni said...

Charlestoncheap columbia jackets. turned a pair of double plays to do the trick. spyder jacketsThe had at least one runner on in every inning but the first and outhit the RiverDogs by a 12-6 margin Lawal should be a focal point of the Yellow cheap polo shirts along with highly touted newcomer, 6-9 Derrick Favors, rated as the No. 1 power forward on the ESPNU 100. The Yellow JacketsThere are ed hardy shirts pretty ed hardy shirt for men,
ed hardy womens in the ed hardy online storedesigned by ed hardy ,many cheap ed hardy shirt ,glasses,caps,trouers ed hardy shirts on sale ,You can go to edhardyshirts.com to have a look ,you may find one of ed hardy clothing fit

huyuni said...

A study last yearnike tn, the author in the essay read NIKE , a reporter at the Shanghai headquarters in an interview, nike chaussuressee a pr in high school to read a league plans, employees interviewed told reporters in Beijing's streets, they children to interview, the children said, "truly understand them." tn chaussures These words, if the author touches product function, brand spirit and culture is to become part of the consumer of two basic methods

theprophet said...

"Why...? Don't you need someone to pose as your girlfriend this year?" Then he answered, "No, there is no need for that anymore......"
Before he can continue, he was interrupted, discount nike shoes"Oh yes! Must have found a girlfriend! nike shox r4 You haven't been searching for one for the past years, right?" The man looked up, as if he has struck gold, his face beamed and looked directly at the drunken girl. tn dollarHe replied, "Yes......you are right! I haven't been looking for anyone for the past years."
With that, the man darted across the floor and out the door, cheap nike shoesleaving the lady in much bewilderment. He finally realized that he has already found his dream girl, and she was.....the Vancouver girl all along! The drunken lady has said something that awoken him.
All along he has found his girl.nike tennis shoes That was why he did not bother to look further when he realized she was not coming back. It was not any specific girl he was seeking! cheap nike shoxIt was perfection that he wanted, and yes.....perfection!!
Relationship is something both parties should work on. Realizing that he had let away someone so important in his life, he decided to call her immediately. His whole mind was flooded with fear.free shipping shoes He was afraid that she might have found someone new or no longer had the same feelings anymore..... For once, he felt the fear of losing someone.
As it was Christmas eve, the line was quite hard to get through, especially an overseas call. He tried again and again, never giving up. Finally, he got through......precisely at 1200 midnight. He confessed his love for her and the girl was moved to tears. nike shoes It seemed that she never got over him! Even after so long, she was still waiting for him, never giving up.
He was so excited to meet her and to begin his new chapter of their lives. He decided to fly to Vancouver to join her. It was the happiest time of their lives! nike discount shoes But their happy time was short-lived. Two days before he was supposed to fly to Vancouver,cheap puma shoes he received a call from her father. She had a head-on car collision with a drunken driver. nike shox shoes She passed away after 6 hours in a coma.
The guy was devastated, as it was a complete loss. Why did fate played such cruel games with him? He cursed the heaven for taking her away from him, denying even one last look at her! How cruel he cursed! How he damned the Gods...!!nike free shoes How he hated himself....for taking so long to realize his mistake!! That was in 1996.
The moral of this story is :
Treasure what you have...
Time is too slow for those who wait;
Too swift for those who fear;
Too long for those who grief;
Too short for those who rejoice;
But for those who love...
Time is Eternity.
For all you out there with someone special in your heart, cherish that person, cherish every moment that you spend together that special someone, for in life, anything can happen anytime. buy shoes onlineYou may painfully regret, only to realise that it is too late.

lixiang said...

Hi, I like your blog, it's, you know, wonderful. I learn a lot from it.
Recently, I am always wanting to buy high quality, low price prince tennis rackets, and I find many places, where sells perfect tennis racket. In order to play the game and search the place where can buy the head tennis racket, and finally, I find thistennis shop. You can buy what you want in this store online.
Would you want to be more attractive? If your answer is "Yes", you can wear best-seller columbia jacket, you really need a pair of white ralph lauren jacket. They can make you become the attactive person.
Would you like wearing cheap polo shirt? Do you want to be a fashion chaser? Follow me and you can chase the most popular white polo shirts. it can help you increase your attraction, you will be the focus wherever you go only if you wear polo clothes.
polo shirt women
polo shirts men's
cheap polo jacket
high quality columbia jacket
claasic north face jacket
perfect spyder jacket
ralph Lauren shirts
polo A&F shirts
polo shirt
north face jackets
polo short sleeves shirt
ralph lauren polo long sleeves shirts
prince accessories
cheap head tennis racquets
wilson tennis racquets
superior babolat tennis racquets
head tennis racquet
babolat racquet
wilson tennis racquets

lady said...

I like the side of the article, and very like your blog, to write well and hope to continue their efforts, we can see more of your articles. ed hardy clothes. After reading this article has strong feelings, the future will be Changlaikankan's.ed hardy swimwear. polo hoodies
ed hardy jeans
ed hardy
ed hardy clothing
ed hardy t-shirts
ed hardy clothes
ed-hardy.co.uk
ed hardy shirts
ed hardy mens
ed hardy clothes
ed hardy womens
ed hardy sunglasses
ed hardy swimwear
ed hardy Jeans
ed hardy hoodies
ed hardy bags
ed hardy trousers
ed hardy shoes
ed hardy sunglasses
ed hardy suits
ed
hardy
ed hardy dresses
ed hardy boots
ed hardy mens sweater
ed hardy womens cotton
ed hardy womens boots

Adi said...

thanks for sharing this info. greets from Pandeglang. Pandeglang is one of many places in Indonesia are eligible for tourist destination.
Kenali dan Kunjungi Objek Wisata di Pandeglang Objek Wisata di Pandeglang Kenali dan Kunjungi Objek Wisata di Pandeglang Pantai Carita Seni Saman Rampak Bedug

Kristen Stewart said...

Online Degree Programs

nike said...

Rubber. Rubber is widly used in the outsole of the athletic shoes.
cheap puma shoes
discount puma shoes
It has the advantages of durable, skipproof, flexible, elastic, extensive, stable and proper hardness.
nike shox torch
nike tn dollar
cheap nike shox
PU is a kind of macromolecule polyurethane materials which is offten used in the midsole
cheap nike shox shoes
nike shox r4
puma mens shoes
Sometimes, it is also used in the outsole of casual shoes.
PU is durable, strong hardness, upstanding flexbility and more important, it is environmentally
cheap nike max
discount nike shox
cheap puma ferrari shoes
The disadvantage is also outstanding. Strong hydroscopic property, break apart and EVA.
nike mens shoes
nike shox nz
discount nike running shoes
which is usually used in the midsole of the running shoes and casual shoes.
EVA is quite lightweight, elastic, flexible and suitable to a variety of climates.
discount nike shoes
nike shox shoes
cheap nike shoes
PHYLON. Phylon is the product of the EVA after the second processing. Just as the rubber
nike sports shoes
puma running shoes
puma sneakers
The midsole of running shoes, tennis shoes and basketball shoes in the world is made PHYLON.
nike air max tn
puma cat
puma shoes
The upstanding hardness, density, traction and extension make it favorite by the manufacture.
nike running shoes
wholesale nike shoes
nike shoes
Just as a coin has two sides, Phylon is nonrecoverable and easily shrink under high PHYLON.
nike shoes kids
nike women shoes

nike said...

You will never find swimsuit more excellent than in Ed Hardy!
ed hardy ugg boots
ed hardy love kills slowly boots
ed hardy love kills slowly
We provide you with the sexiest swimwear at present. Wanting to be bright on beach in this
ed hardy polo shirts
ed hardy love kills slowly shoes
ed hardy wear
Abandoning traditional concepts on sexy swimwear, Ed Hardy adds tattoo upon, which is meaning
ed hardy love kills slowly shirts
ed hardy trousers
ed hardy jackets
It seems that ed hardy mens shoes was difficult to be able to let you exist out in swimwear, the
ed hardy t shirts sale
ed hardy womens t shirts
ed hardy boots
In the trunks term, the Panerai candy-flush has mainly took the Louis Vuitton Speedy purpose
ed hardy womens clothes
ed hardy womens shirts
ed hardy clothes
swimwear in an austere tone proposal combines the exclusive tailoring, Cool down, sunshine fair,
ed hardy outerwear
ed hardy womens
ed hardy womens jeans
green MOISTURE, attractive red no other elements, together with the unique thwart-buckle create
ed hardy bags
ed hardy winter boots
ed hardy t shirts
Whether it is sexy bikini, or cross-quantity g-star trunks intended to reach new heights with this
ed hardy bags
ed hardy winter boots
ed hardy t shirts
The desired redden of this type of bag, but once again the label that ed hardy and the Christian Audigier Brand Manage Louboutin at MAGIC in August 2009.
ed hardy t shirts for men
ed hardy mens jeans
ed hardy mens shoes
The total spectrum of Audigier Brand Management lifestyle brands and crop will be including ed hardy shirts,
ed hardy mens shoes
ed hardy womens hoodies
ed hardy mens tees
food ranging from ment and woment garb, accessories, footwear. Christian Audigier, SMET, Crystal Rock

linran said...

I have read your blog for many times, and I think it very wonderful. I love some of your articles, they are meaningfull. And what do you think of polo shirts, I think they are are very chic, especially the polo t shirts, I love them very much. I also like playing tennis rackets, it can keep healthy, what do you like to do in your spare time?
cheap tennis racket
discount tennis racket
prince tennis racquet
head tennis rackets
wilson tennis racket
babolat tennis racquet
polo t shirts women
polo t shirts on sale
polo t shirts for women
polo shirts on sale
polo shirts men
men's polo shirt
men polo shirt
mens polo shirts
mens polo shirt
cheap polo shirts
discount polo shirts
men's polo shirts
women's polo shirts

men's clothing said...

chaussures homme
chaussures homme nike
chaussures homme pas cher
acheter chaussures homme

janewangleilei said...

You can have a look at it.
jordan shoes
jordan ajf shoes
There are cheap shoes to choose
jordan 6
jordan flight 45
Good quality with low price.
air jordan 2010
Air Jordan 2009
Enjoy it!
jumpman
jordan 28
Wow.
newest jordans
Wonderful!
air yeezy
jordan true flight
I can't believe it.
nike outlet
adidas outlet
puma outlet

real_tips said...

feminist movement is going strong in NY..

http://britesmile-whitening.blogspot.com


http://the-laser-eye-treatment.blogspot.com

http://laser-correction.blogspot.com

http://alcoholic-rehabilitation-info.blogspot.com


http://alcohol-abuse-rehab.blogspot.com

http://help-for-alcoholism.blogspot.com

http://private-jet-charters-web.blogspot.com


http://term-life-quotes-info.blogspot.com

http://motorcycle-injury-lawyer.blogspot.com

http://drug-lawyer-info.blogspot.com


http://eloan-loan.blogspot.com

http://home-equity-lending.blogspot.com

http://mesothelioma-support-group.blogspot.com


http://brown-leather-office-chair.blogspot.com

http://little-tikes-doll-house.blogspot.com

http://bearington-teddy-bears.blogspot.com




http://boyds-bears-ornaments.blogspot.com

http://pore-cleanser-web.blogspot.com

http://complex-acne.blogspot.com


http://acid-reflux-diet-web.blogspot.com

http://beauty-for-nails.blogspot.com

http://cellulite-brush.blogspot.com


http://cellulite-and-liposuction.blogspot.com

http://printed-golf-balls.blogspot.com

http://diaper-cloth.blogspot.com


http://remove-tattoo-fast.blogspot.com

http://skin-microdermabrasion.blogspot.com

http://babor-products.blogspot.com

hanly said...

Blu Ray Converter
Convert Blu Ray to AVI
Convert Blu Ray to MKV
Convert Blu Ray to MOV
Convert Blu Ray to MP4

Larah said...

I try to finish my capstone project about feminism! Your post helps me.

dfadf said...

Microsoft Office
Office 2010
Microsoft Office 2010
Office 2010 key
Office 2010 download
Office 2010 Professional
Microsoft outlook
Outlook 2010
Windows 7
Microsoft outlook 2010

GuestUser said...

Harga Mobil Bekas | Ramalan 2011 | Video Tante Girang | Foto Pernikahan Pasha dan Delia | Update Status Romantis | Tante Girang | No HP Tante Girang | Daftar Harga HP Bekas | Bug Pada Game Point Blank Online | Biro Jodoh Online | Ramalan Bintang | Ramalan Shio Zodiak Tionghoa | Point Blank Online Indonesia | Status Keren | Harga HP Android | Point Blank Online | Cara Daftar Point Blank Online | ucapan valentine 2011 | Makanan khas natal 2010 | Film terbaru 2011 | trend model gaya rambut 2011 | games.co.id | Ramalan tahun kelinci 2011 | Car review | New Car Release | Blog berita terkini | Charlotte auto insurance | TV Online Indonesia | Mivo TV | Puppy Dog Food Store | Debby Ayu Bugill | Indonesia Vs Filipina | Juara Piala AFF Suzuki Cup 2010 | Kumpulan berita baru point blank Berita terbaru adidas online store

happyoutlet said...

Each of the women in the photochi flat iron below were all men dream Christmas, depriving the tiny, tiny Santa suit.

It is undeniablechi flat irons that eachchi straightener of these ladies look Smokin hot in their best clothes, but the choices you hot, is a very difficult task.

Choirul said...

niche blog game online terbaru, game online, cerita lucu, tante girang, fb

web said...

This is the perfect blog for anyone who wants to know about this topic. You know so much its almost hard to argue with you (not that I really would want...HaHa). You definitely put a new spin on a subject thats been written about for years. Great stuff, just great....
cerita dewasa foto bugil bokep 3gp gambar bugil cewek bugil cerita dewasa

andre12323 said...

dsquareddsquared
dsquared shoesdsquared shoes
dsquared shoes 2011dsquared shoes 2011
dsquared jeans womendsquared jeans women
dsquared t shirtsdsquared t shirts
dsquared jeans mendsquared jeans men
dsquared hoodiesdsquared hoodies
dsquared beltsdsquared belts
asics shoes saleasics shoes sale
asics shoesasics shoes
asics running shoesasics running shoes
asics mexico 66asics mexico 66
onitsuka kanuchionitsuka kanuchi
timberland bootstimberland boots
christian louboutin shoeschristian louboutin shoes
karen millen dresseskaren millen dresses
nike air max plusnike air max plus
maillot de football 2011maillot de football 2011

Ross said...

christian louboutin shoeschristian louboutin shoes
christian louboutin bootschristian louboutin boots
christian louboutin sandalschristian louboutin sandals
christian louboutin slingbackchristian louboutin slingback
christian louboutin sneakerschristian louboutin sneakers
christian louboutin wedgeschristian louboutin wedges
christian louboutin weddingchristian louboutin wedding
timberland bootstimberland boots
asics shoesasics shoes
asics running shoesasics running shoes
dsquared jeans mendsquared jeans men
dsquared shoes 2011dsquared shoes 2011
karen millen dresseskaren millen dresses
marque t shirtmarque t shirt

Chellen said...

dsquareddsquared
dsquared shoesdsquared shoes
dsquared shoes 2011dsquared shoes 2011
dsquared jeans womendsquared jeans women
dsquared t shirtsdsquared t shirts
dsquared jeans mendsquared jeans men
dsquared hoodiesdsquared hoodies
dsquared beltsdsquared belts
asics shoes saleasics shoes sale
asics shoesasics shoes
asics running shoesasics running shoes
asics mexico 66asics mexico 66
onitsuka kanuchionitsuka kanuchi
karen millen dresseskaren millen dresses
nike air max plusnike air max plus
maillot de football 2011maillot de football 2011
Armani boxermaillot de football 2011

Chellen said...

asics shoesasics shoes
asics running shoesasics running shoes
dsquared jeans mendsquared jeans men
dsquared shoes 2011dsquared shoes 2011
karen millen dresseskaren millen dresses
lacoste pas cher lacoste pas cher

Peter said...

nice share thanks a lot :)

download free pc games
affiliate review

vibrams said...

All the cheap christian louboutin heels for retailing inside our store can be to offer solutions of first-class quality. The christian louboutin evening complete great deal could possibly be the fine and fashionable one.They take place in fascinating design and layout and fashionable appearnce.The colourway also is quite popular. These christian louboutin pumps are luxury and noble. The christian louboutin peep toe show formal, a complete great deal extra show its gorgeous gloss and honour. hold into some mysterious alluring taste! This pairs of christian louboutin 2011 sandals attributes a quite considerable component for women's fabulous whole system figure, show their fabulous figure and fashionable gesture. Louboutin heels is a good choice for you, welcome to our Christian louboutin store!

abercrombiefitch said...

the iconic sneaker was originally introduced on now.
Nike Air Max 2011
Nike Air Max Shoes
Nike Air Max
Nike Air Max Wildwood Supreme
Nike Air Max Turbulence
Nike Air Max Skyline
Nike Air Max Goadome
Nike Air Max Fitsole
Nike Air Max Zenyth
Nike Air Max Boots
Nike Air Max Zoom Kobe
Nike Air Max Tn
Nike Air Max LTD
Nike Air Max Presto
Nike Air Max BW
Nike Air Max 24 7
Nike Air Max 2010
Nike Air Max 2011
Nike Air Max 2009
Nike Air Max 95
Nike Air Max 91
Nike Air Max 87
Nike Air Max 180
Nike Air Max Griffey Max 1
Nike Air Max 90
Nike Air Max 1
Abercrombie and Fitch London
Abercrombie & Fitch Clothes
Vibram Shoes
Cheap Air Max
Nike Air Max Shoes
is available in a vivid array of colors, including, Jiffy Black, Pigeon Grey, Shell White, Dodger Blue, and Beaver Brown.

jelish said...

Dear friends,Cheap Sale Louboutin online.All shoes elegant shoes is one of masterpiece from Christian Louboutin Evenings. When you buy yourself a pair of Christian Louboutin Pumps shoes you allow yourself to benefit from the vast experience and expertise that this brand has collected over the years.Christian Louboutin Slingbacks shoes is the personification of women,is their direct orgin of racial pride.Christian Louboutin Peep Toe shoes is the personification of women,is their direct orgin of racial pride.Welcome to our Louboutin 2011 stoer.http://www.sale-louboutin-shoes.us

jelish said...

Christian Louboutin Outlet Online Store offer 2011 new-style Christian Louboutin Sale Outlet online store.We will provide you with all kinds of CL.The Christian Louboutin Ankle Boots serve different functions and keep your feet stylish and warm,Christian Louboutin High Heels can always show our body in the best charming way, making her legs look as long as possible.Christian Louboutin New Style are the best choice for you to choose the brand, especially you want to keep steps to the fashion world.Christian Louboutin Peep Toes that are considered as classic due to the fact they are comfortable.Buy cheap Louboutin Outlet shoes, get your favorite.
http://www.christianlouboutinoutletonline.org

janet li said...

Hello!It is my first time visit your website.It is nice,just like our website.Yes,we are the cheapest ghd outlet.All of the Discount GHD Straighteners on sale here are high quality,and free shipping.I don't know whether you have already have a flat iron,we here have the ghd uk for your choice.Australia is our main market as well.ghd australia also on sale.If you want to have a differdent hairstyle with less money,then come to our website,we have the confidence that we will bring you a nice mood everyday.Pick your beauty now,It is suitable for both men and women.Come on,your beauty is in our website waits for you.what's more,with a nice hairstyle,i think you will also need a nice christian louboutin sale shoes and Ghd Australia to match your hairstyle.
At last,thanks for sharing your articles.May you happy everyday.

Nora said...

Wow! What can I say?Truely a nice article and thanks for your great work. By the way,welcome to our websites. You most definitely have made this article into something special. At the same time,Welcome to look at my website ghd uk and hope we can become good friends, and exchange and to help each other! Thanks.Best Ghd Hair Straightener
What's more, you can visit Ghd Australia to browse New Hair Straighteners
You may also like Ghd Australia, Ghd Hair Straightener and Ghd Australia.
http://www.ghd-chi-australia.com

Friday said...

All the cheap christian louboutin heels and louboutin heels for retailing inside our store can be to offer solutions of first-class quality. The christian louboutin evening complete great deal could possibly be the fine and fashionable one.They take place in fascinating design and layout and fashionable appearnce.The colourway also is quite popular. These christian louboutin pumps are luxury and noble.The christian louboutin peep toe show formal, a complete great deal extra show its gorgeous gloss and honour. hold into some mysterious alluring taste! This pairs of christian louboutin 2011 sandals attributes a quite considerable component for women's fabulous whole system figure, show their fabulous figure and fashionable gesture. Louboutin heels is a good choice for you, welcome to our Christian louboutin store!

Friday said...

The christian louboutin outlet heels can help you become sexy and elegant. Cheap christian louboutin sandals are regarded since the symbolic representation of attractive and elegant.Christian Louboutin Ankle BootsIt is especially suitable for the women who wear theChristian Louboutin Collection 2011 shoes at the first time.These Christian Louboutin Heels 2011 combine top quality, reasonable price and fashional design, which is your best choice Artist who promoted his collection of luxury women's Christian Louboutin Peep Toes in earlier 90s. No 1 can disregard the existence in the style world, World-famous red-colored soles and Christian Louboutin Pumps Sale are shaped features. However, you can by no means overlook the beautiful. You do not even need to go inside environment, as well as your slim, gorgeous and graceful legs may be effortlessly discovered in people's eyes! Welcome to our louboutin mall to buy discount louboutins heels.

xiaofen said...

You wish for getting to create people nowadays worried about women? can you need a awesome coloring as women? We are Louboutin 2011store. we are able to provide you using a broad wide variety of Sale Louboutin. For example:Christian Louboutin Slingbacks,Christian Louboutin Peep Toe,Christian Louboutin Evenings,Christian Louboutin Pumps. andChristian Louboutin Mensis a very distinctive design, its design reflects its style. You put on it, that means you have its style.You put on it, that means you have its style.They are astonishingly psychological color. Please do not pass up an superb chance.
http://www.sale-louboutin-shoes.us

Maria said...

Nice principle.,Can you check my link?==>big and tall suits

Fashionable life said...

Christian Louboutin Store is commonly a European shoe. Artist who promoted his collection of luxury women's Christian louboutin pumps sale in earlier 90s. Christian Louboutin Tall Boots can disregard the existence in the style world, World-famous red-colored soles and Christian louboutin sale discount are shaped features. However, you can by no means overlook the beautiful Christian louboutin classic shoes. You do not even need to go inside environment, as well as your slim, gorgeous and graceful legs may be effortlessly discovered in people's eyes for Discount louboutins.

dsadf said...

he actual Oughout Benjamin Pineda Gomez stated he previously zero name or even information about the person who diedDressed up in the olive airfare Ed Hardy go well with in addition to helmet, the actual emporer who is minute inside series towards the throne satisfied the large chopper on the Nike Air Max normal water many times throughout an hour or so Two of this alerts faulted the organization for the crisis reply and pipe deterioration Ed Hardy Shop Corporation spokesperson Alan Jeffers explained there was zero primary association amongst people problems and also the direction failureIn DALVAY BY-THE-SEA, Prince Edward Area (AP) Burberry cheap Prince Bill enjoyed showing his or her army heli-copter instruction with his first-ever h2o landing Saturday to the pleasure involving nervous throngs in Canada, Cheap Air Max exactly where he / she with his fantastic better half, Kate, have been getting their first recognized international excursion considering that the weddingOhydratesTransport Section Air Max 2011 speaker Patricia Klinger claimed the organization features because answered the warnings as well as the circumstance seemed to be sealed The item says "testing Cheap Air Max Shoes this weibo

LauraStarBene said...

Nice post! Thanks for sharing!
Comprare Reductil

JimHalpert said...

When you have got a possibility to use thebuying essays service, do not doubt, purchase essays and just relax.

Al Gorgon said...

Thank you for this very useful information.
Coursework
Research Paper Writing
Book Report Writing

nike air max said...

buy best nike air max shoes, Welcome to visit

Happy Baby Peplo said...

We are dedicated to delivering the most recent and greatest high quality Louboutin Heels along with other artist at Cheap Ugg Uk.With this broad variety of Christian louboutin Heels and the beautiful Moncler Outlet and Moncler Outlet Online at our Moncler Online Shop. now gets the ladies' favorite. New Best Hair Straightener from our finest locks Straightener on the Chi Hair Straightene anything you have to produce Babyliss Hair Straightener that great bohemian style.

Admin said...

I gave up. I now work at a job far below my qualifications. I was making more in engineering almost 20 years ago than I am making now, and that's in unadjusted dollars. I have read some about the feminization of the American office, and it seems other people have had experiences similar to mine. It seems as if these days, in order to succeed in the office environment, you have to apologize not only for being in charge, but also for being male.

I also read that our young boys are being punished in elementary school for acting like boys.

I will be glad when the pendulum swings back toward the center again.

Rizkythea | Eval Blog | Celebrity Biography | BoyKB News | Blogger Asyik | Car Collections | Interiorking.com | interioronly.com | Celebrity Diet Rules

Nevermore said...

There are some shoes that undoubtedly call up for no explanation. The Nike air Max 90 is one of those people air max shoes. The past basic performance operating shoe altered the film game back again through its preliminary release, and offered that then has turn out to be among one of the most well-known casual types of all time by method of a mixture of comfort, collaborations and unforgettable colorways.

Olivia said...

Your Escort Agency offers exclusive and most beautiful London escort girls of various nationalities.
Your Escort Agency

hbalxb said...

black boots

Chocolate boots

sand boots

Chestnut boots

gray boots

pink boots

grey boots

Ugg Boots For Sale

Sand Ugg Boots

Rita said...

Bestescort4U more then ten years providing best London escorts companionship in the UK.
London escorts

joe said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Escorts London said...

Hot - Collection is a honest and confidential London escort agency which provides genuine London escorts girls for gentlemen of taste.
London escorts

jhon said...

nice post love reading it
women leather biker jacket

luck said...

uggs clearance A different characteristic from the net is searching mall clubs which you'll join to ensure that you'll be able to get your Ugg boots through the virtual Uggs Outlet buying mall plan and that far too at a low cost. All purchases could be designed utilizing credit cards and in the handful of days time, it is possible to obtain the really pair that you simply requested and compensated for at your doorstep ugg boots clearance.

Seacanoeist Mark said...

Welcome to http://www.mmoggg.de website to buy RS Gold, offer a lot, of course, Diablo 3 Gold or Diablo 3 Gold Kaufen and WoW Gold, to be purchased at any time, at any time shipment, and look forward to your visit!

Jennifer Nathan said...

Great wordpress blog here.. It’s hard to find quality writing like yours these days. I really appreciate people like you! take care
Small Business Loans